June 15, 2008

  • Who would God deny?

    What are your thoughts??????

    With the rising cost of health care and
    prescriptions many people are caused to go without preventative or
    immediate care for illnesses they have causing progression of the
    disease or even worse death. Even if the care is offered the person
    is denied by their medical insurance if they are lucky enough to have
    insurance due to their qualifying health questions. As Christians we
    are taught to love our neighbors as our selves and to help our fellow
    man or woman. So the question is who would God deny? Who is unworthy
    of life saving medical care? God allowed anyone to come to him
    through his son Jesus Christ to receive what they needed should not
    our health care be the same?

    Last night my husband and I watched
    Sicko by Micheal Moore. It really made me think. Some of you may
    know that March 2007 I was hospitalized with pneumonia. We had
    insurance but of course the insurance doesn’t cover everything. The
    bills started coming in. We called the hospital to set up payments.
    We were told that they don’t do payments. They wanted all the money
    in one payment. We didn’t have that type of money. They had the nerve
    to tell us we should put it on a credit card. (We don’t do credit
    cards) So they ended up sending us a letter telling us we were banned
    from the whole network (that is all the drs in this area and the
    hospital). The bill was sent to collections which were very nice and
    allowed us to set up payments and the bill is now all payed off.

    This whole experiences really made me
    think. It is bad when a person has to sit at home and tell their
    husband that they could have afforded for the person to died better
    then going to get help.

    There are many people dying because
    they can not afford the treatments that they need. There are people
    loosing everything to pay for the treatments they need. All this is
    happening here in American.

    One-fifth of all Americans, 48.8
    million individuals, were in families spending more than 10% of their
    family income on healthcare in 2003, an increase of 11.7 million
    persons since 1996. Of these, 18.7 million (7.3%) were spending more
    than 20% of family income, a figure normally associated with home
    ownership. The percent of middle-income Americans (22.7%) spending
    over 10% of their income on healthcare was almost identical to the
    percent of low-income Americans (23.7%) on healthcare (JAMA, Dec. 13,
    2006).

    Half of all personal bankruptcies are
    caused by illness or medical bills. The number of medical
    bankruptcies has increased by 2200% since 1981 (Health Affairs,
    February, 2005). Two-thirds of people with a medical bill or debt
    problem went without needed care due to cost (Commonwealth Fund,Aug.
    2005).

    Nearly 30% of low and middle-income
    households with credit card debt cite medical debt as a contributing
    factor; 69% of those had a major medical expense in the previous
    three years (Borrowing to Stay Healthy: How Credit Card Debt Is
    Related to Medical Expenses, Demos,The Access Project, January, 2007)

    Uninsured, national — 46.8 million
    (15.9% of the population), 2005, up from 45.3 million in 2004.
    Hispanics highest rate of uninsured – 32.7%; African-Americans,
    19.6%; Asians, 17.9%; whites, 15%; children, 11.2%; middle-income
    ($50k–$75k), 14.1%; work full-time, 17.7% (U.S. Census Bureau). 82
    million, or one in three non-elderly Americans, went without health
    insurance during 2003–2004 (Washington Post, Dec. 13, 2006).

    Lack of health insurance causes 18,000
    unnecessary deaths every year (Institute of Medicine, January 14,
    2004), the equivalent of six times the number who died in 9/11.
    (Louisville Courier-Journal, Jan. 30, 2006)

    Underinsured, national — 17.1 million
    people under 65 in 2003 (JAMA, Dec. 13, 2006). “Underinsured”
    person defined as someone with health expenses exceeding 10% of his
    or her income. Among the underinsured, 38% did not fill prescriptions
    due to cost, 32% went without seeing a doctor when needed, 30%
    avoided medical tests, treatment or follow-up care. 18% declined care
    from specialists. 46% reported being contacted by a collection agency
    about unpaid medical bills. 35% reported changing their lifestyle to
    cover medical expenses (Health Affairs, June 14,
    2005).

    The United States is the only wealthy,
    industrialized nation that does not have a universal health care
    system.

    Whether
    a government mandated system of universal health care should be
    implemented in the U.S. remains a hotly debated political topic.
    What are your thoughts?

    Common arguments forwarded by
    supporters of universal health care systems include:

    * Health care is a basic human
    right or entitlement.

    * Ensuring the health of all
    citizens benefits a nation economically.

    * About 60% of the U.S. health care
    system is already publicly financed with federal and state taxes,
    property taxes, and tax subsidies – a universal healthcare system
    would merely replace private/employer spending with taxes. Total
    spending would go down for individuals and employers.

    * A single payer system could save
    $286 billion a year in overhead and paperwork. Administrative costs
    in the U.S. health care system are substantially higher than those in
    other countries and than in the public sector in the US: one estimate
    put the total administrative costs at 24 percent of U.S. health care
    spending.

    * Several studies have shown a
    majority of taxpayers and citizens across the political divide would
    prefer a universal healthcare system over the current U.S. system

    * Universal health care would
    provide for uninsured adults who may forgo treatment needed for
    chronic health conditions.

    * Wastefulness and inefficiency in
    the delivery of health care would be reduced.

    * America spends a far higher
    percentage of GDP on health care than any other country but has worse
    ratings on such criteria as quality of care, efficiency of care,
    access to care, safe care, equity, and wait times, according to the
    Commonwealth Fund.

    * A universal system would align
    incentives for investment in long term health-care productivity,
    preventive care, and better management of chronic conditions.

    * Universal health care could act
    as a subsidy to business, at no cost thereto. (Indeed, the Big Three
    of U.S. car manufacturers cite health-care provision as a reason for
    their ongoing financial travails. The cost of health insurance to
    U.S. car manufacturers adds between USD 900 and USD 1,400 to each car
    made in the U.S.A.)

    * The profit motive adversely
    affects the cost and quality of health care. If managed care programs
    and their concomitant provider networks are abolished, then doctors
    would no longer be guaranteed patients solely on the basis of their
    membership in a provider group and regardless of the quality of care
    they provide. Theoretically, quality of care would increase as true
    competition for patients is restored.

    * A 2008 opinion poll of 2,000 US
    doctors found support for a universal healthcare plan at 59%-32%,
    which is up from the 49%-40% opinion of physicians in 2002. These
    numbers include 83% of psychiatrists, 69% of emergency medicine
    specialists, 65% of pediatricians, 64% of internists, 60% of family
    physicians and 55% of general surgeons. The reasons given are an
    inability of doctors to decide patient care and patients who are
    unable to afford care.

    * According to an estimate by Dr.
    Marcia Angell roughly 50% of healthcare dollars are spent on
    healthcare, the rest go to various middlemen and intermediaries. A
    streamlined, non-profit, universal system would increase the
    efficiency with which money is spent on healthcare.

    * In countries in Western Europe
    with public universal health care, private health care is also
    available, and one may choose to use it if desired. Most of the
    advantages of private health care continue to be present, see also
    Two-tier health care.

    * Universal health care and public
    doctors would protect the right to privacy between insurance
    companies and patients.

    * Public health care system can be
    used as independent third party in disputes between employer and
    employee.

    Common arguments forwarded by opponents
    of universal health care systems include:

    * Health care is not a right. As
    such, it is not the responsibility of government to provide health
    care.

    * If universal health care is
    provided by federally mandated purchase of health insurance, it may
    be unconstitutional, since the Constitution does not give the federal
    government this right and reserves all non-mentioned rights to the
    States or the People.

    * Universal heath care would result
    in increased wait times, which could result in unnecessary deaths.

    * Unequal access and health
    disparities still exist in universal health care systems.

    * Universal health care would
    reduce efficiency because of more bureaucratic oversight and more
    paperwork, which could lead to fewer doctor-patient visits.[citation
    needed] Advocates of this argument claim that the performance of
    administrative duties by doctors results from medical centralization
    and over-regulation, and may reduce charitable provision of medical
    services by doctors.

    * Many problems that universal
    health insurance is meant to solve are presumed caused by limitations
    on the free market. As such, free market solutions have greater
    potential to improve care and coverage.

    * The federal Emergency Medical
    Treatment and Active Labor Act requires hospitals and ambulance
    services to provide emergency care to anyone regardless of
    citizenship, legal status or ability to pay. The health care safety
    net, which includes free medical clinics, charity care, nonprofits
    and government-run community hospitals, provides necessary care to
    the uninsured.

    * The widely quoted health care
    system ranking by the World Health Organization, in which the US
    system ranked below other countries’ universal health care systems,
    used biased criteria, giving a false sense of those systems’
    superiority.

    * Empirical evidence on the
    Medicare single payer-insurance program demonstrates that the cost
    exceeds the expectations of advocates. As an open-ended entitlement,
    Medicare does not weigh the benefits of technologies against their
    costs. Paying physicians on a fee-for-service basis also leads to
    spending increases. As a result, it is difficult to predict or
    control Medicare’s spending. Large market-based public program such
    as the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program and CalPERS can
    provide better coverage than Medicare while still controlling costs
    as well.

    * Universal health care systems, in
    an effort to control costs by gaining or enforcing monopsony power,
    sometimes outlaw medical care paid for by private, individual funds.

    So what are your thoughts? Are you for Universal Health care? Why? Are you against it? Why?

    Do you have insurance? Any insurance horror stories?

Comments (20)

  • I know with my history there were many times I might have died had I not recieved adequate care, however there are countries all over the world where this is commonplace.  People die becasue they don’t have clean drinking water, or the equipment to sterilize stuff. 

    We had almost moved to Canada last year, yes, they do have universal health care, but their taxes are double, and you may need to wait up to a year for a non life threatening surgery.  One friend had a painful arthritic hip that needed to be replaced she had to wait a year and then travel 8 hours to a specialist. 

    The grass isn’t always greener.

    Are you saying God denys the people in third world countries?

  • my husband was active duty military for 21 years, so the medical care we had for all that time was what I believe would be similar to fully subsidized health care for all Americans. Yes, there were horror stories. You had no choice in what doctors you saw. There was alot of waiting. But the point is, we DID receive medical care. If some sort of universal health care system is put into place, there will be alot of complaining by people who feel they are “entitled” to certain rights. It’s like socialised medicine in France or Germany. (one of my children has had surgery in Germany twice, been hospitalised in German hospitals about 5 times, and my husband twice as well…) In America, we really are used to having choices. But our health care system has gotten ridiculous. The cost of pharmaceuticals is beyond crazy! Something has to be done, obviously.

    My two “horror” stories that are personally mine aren’t awful…one actually ended up as an answer to prayer! 1) I’ve gotten pap smears every years for as long as I’ve been married (nearly 24 years.) Turned out I’d had 5 years w/abnormal paps, and these results had fallen through the cracks, never been reported to either a primary care doc or to me. I ended up having alot of my cervix removed. 2) I had to have 3 jaw surgeries, the last done by a civilian surgeon, bc military docs messed me up the first two times. Our insurance covered very little of this huge cost, and it took almost everything we had to pay for it. We prayed about it, and 5 months later, got nearly a full refund.

    Our commander’s wife several years ago had the same problem (positive pap smears that went unreported.) By the time her problem was “discovered”, it was too late. She died. Her family sued. (she was German.)

  • Ask Canadians how universal healthcare is working for them. They pay a 50% income tax on all wages. 50% of all their income goes straight to the government to pay for universal healthcare and other government sanctioned programs. Universal healthcare sound like a cure but it is not. It is merely a bandaid that eventually the wound will bleed out of and then where to we go. So we really want to be a socialist nation? Do we really want the gonvernment to tell us we have to go to certain doctors even if the doctor isnt a good doctor. When the government starts paying for things like healthcare we give away a certain amount of personal rights. We no longer have the right to dictate how we want our treatment. We arent paying for it (except through the nose on our taxes) so we have no right to dictate our healthcare our government now has that right.
    One way to fix this is to throw the stupid petty lawsuits out of court! I know there are some bad doctors who have ruined peoples lives so some malpractice suits are necessary. I would wager that most are frivolous. They are people out to make a buck at the doctors expense. I have a scar from my surgery and I now have mental anguish. Well duh they did open heart surgery stuff like that.
    In the county I grew up in Malpractice insurance for an OB/GYN is  $100,000-$200,000 a year! No wonder they have to charge exorbitant prices They have to start their year just covering their insurance! Why because our society thinks that everything should work out perfectly nothing should go wrong and if it does it is the doctors fault. When we fix the malpractice suit issue and fix the fact that there are places in America that doctors wont practice because they cant afford insurance then we can figure out to lower other costs. Americans are good at this we get ourselves into a predicament then we whine to the government to fix our problem. Though you might not have had a lawsuit you are a part of society. We should carry the blame as well as gouging doctors and hospitals for the healthcare crisis not the governmant.
    Okay that is my 2 cents.

  • I am one of those who is not for Universal Healthcare.  I feel personally that medical insurance is a choice and I think in the end it will be the government making out on the deal.  Most importantly I have family members who lived in countries who had the Universal Healthcare system and I can speak for them by saying it was very scary.  My mother said when she had her children in a communist country they didn’t give a toot about you and your baby.  When she had to have an operation she had to fly to Russia and get it done.  It ended up costing them much more then it would have if they had private insurance.  The government cuts corners whenever they can and that at times means many proceedures will have huge waiting lists or you will have to travel great distances to recieve medical care.

    Government run healthcare seems like a great idea but behind it is not so pretty for us citizens.  Lack of good doctors, lack of hospitals available, lack of immediate services, and most importantly you will see those who have extra money in their pockets “paying off” doctors to get better care.  This will leave those who can not afford to do that to be left out in the dust.  This happens in the middle east alot.  I hope to not see this type of healthcare in my lifetime but it seems to be creeping up on us quickly.  Anything that gives the government more control or ability to control our lives is a bad thing if you ask me.  Next thing you know they will be placing chips in our bodies with all our information.

    When it sounds to good it usually is to good to be true.  There is always an agenda behind it.

    Christine

  • I will tell you that I am against universal health care because we shouldn’t be forced into helping our fellow man, we should do it out of the love of God (by choice)!  I am a firm believer that God provides, and he can provide health care and the money to pay for it if more people would trust Him financially.  I’ve learned this the hard way.  You can’t wait for God to provide then take care of things, it doesn’t  work that way. God wants to see our faith, so we must give to Him first then trust that He will provide the rest!

  • Definitely not for universal healthcare.  I do believe “all the days planned for me were written in His book before one of them came to be..” and I trust that until the Lord calls me home, I’ll be hanging around.  However, I do see our health care system as being very messed up.  Mostly because of a lack of price control.  When in the hospital tylenol can cost up to 10.00 per pill.  That’s insane.  Then there’s the cost of prescription meds.  There’s a time period where generics cannot be produced.  Pharmaceutical companies are allowed to lobby docs the way lobbyists go after politicians!   I believe there’s good and healthy capitalism, then there’s the kind that’s driven by greed and the ungodly desire for gain, gain and more gain. 

    That’s what’s corrupted the system.  However, I don’t think doing away with the current system is the answer.  I do believe some changes need to be made,  but socializing medicine is not the answer.  We’re just looking at bigger trouble down the road.

  • Health care is not a right.  It never has been.  The feds need to get their noses out of it & let the free market work. The health care in countries where it has been socialized is sub-par; even Canadian doctors are crossing the border to work here;.

    I hear a lot of “something needs to be done”.  What needs to be done is the church, individually & corporately, needs to get off of it’s fanny & take back the areas that it did so well~ health care, helping the truly poor (not the lazy poor), education, etc.  Anything the gov’t removes from the private sector & takes over gets messed up badly.  I not only don’t want any one telling me that I can’t get certain care (that includes the FDA getting involved in telling me what treatments I can risk), I don’t want anyone saying I’m not worthy of receiving care because my preventative  measures were not sufficient.  Mark my words, when gov’t gets involved to the extent the liberal side would like it to, those who didn’t “take care of themselves” will be put behind those who took every preventative measure, including medications that harm more than they treat, and there are many of those.
    Medical care was much cheaper when doctors billed their patients & didn’t have to pay support staff to wrangle with insurance companies, & when they didn’t have to be afraid of being sued simply for being fallible humans like the rest of us.   
    OK, I’ll get off the soapbox now.  
    Dee

  • Partial quote from flipperiferous“I believe there’s good and healthy
    capitalism, then there’s the kind that’s driven by greed and the
    ungodly desire for gain, gain and more gain.”

    I believe the later of this quote is what’s driving our current health care system. Billions of dollars are wasted every year by advertising to the general public, particularly in the form of pharmaceutical commercials and magazine ads, lobbying efforts and gouging by insurance companies.

    At the time the Medicare Prescription Drug Program was introduced, my insurance carrier reported a staggering 28% increase in quarterly profits and is still reporting record gains each quarter, yet they continue to limit or deny coverage of the most expensive and medically necessary drugs. There’s also the issue of manipulating the Tiers in which medications fall under to ensure the highest possible profit. As long as insurance companies exist and are allowed to redefine written policies at will, determine what is customary and medically necessary, there’s going to be a huge problem. 

    In regards to a National Health Care System, even if the amount of money required to run a national system were available, I have my doubts as to whether those in government could be trusted to be fiscally responsible. Our tax dollars buy $700 toilet seats and Bridges To No Where. The greedy and self-serving would find a way to benefit financially one way or another by taking what isn’t and shouldn’t be theirs to take.  

  • I may have missed it, but have you done something different with yer hair?

    Happy Father’s Day to your hubby,

    God Bless,

    Robert

  • Absolutely not. Why should others pay for your needs? What gives others the right to demand it? That seems rather un-Christian. I think the hospital was jerking you around. You didn’t have to put it on a credit card, and they cannot deny you subsequent service. That’s illegal. If you would have persisted, they would have worked out payments with you and it could have been kept out of collections, unless you mean hospital collections. Is that what happened? Anyway, the biggest mistake you have made is watching that propagandist movie. The USA has the best health care in the world, despite what that lying sack of crap Michael Moore says. Any problems we already do have in heath care can be traced back to government interference in the free markets. And no, I’m not bitter. I just have convictions.

  • Rev. 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
    Reads pretty clear to me.

    An you should never treat your mind like a garbage disposal.  If you allow garbage to enter your mind you will most certainly think negative.  An if you treat your mind with caution you will think with a more postive light.  America is still the leading country in the world when it comes to everything.  Certainly , the health care first and foremost.  An no medical physican or office, hospital of any kind can refuse medical treatment EVER !  It is unethical and they can most certainly lose their license.  I know this first hand as I worked in a hospital (operating room ) for years and also had to be educated on the federal and state laws. 

    I do however think that everyone deserves a decent health care insurance.  An something needs to be done.  Not everyone is “BORN WITH A SILVER SPOON IN THEIR MOUTH.”  An not everyone has the same chances as everyone else.  Common sense would tell you that.  Though many lack common since which is why they can’t see that Americas health care system does need to re-vamped.  An those who say they “should not pay for others health care”
     can only say that because they are not lacking it and should the rolls ever turn I hardly doubt they would ever repeat those words. 

  • @yorel - I question how you would answer her question were you to find yourself laid-off, and then shortly thereafter in very bad health.  Through absolutely no fault of your own, you have no income and no health insurance, and a growing pile of medical bills.

    You will find that the right to live a healthy life in the USA is suddenly tied to your social class.  Only the rich are deserving of living a life of freedom from fear of illness or injury.

    You think that if you work hard and save money, nobody should take it away through taxes to cover his/her medical bills.  You think this until, through no fault of your own, you find yourself in their shoes.

    Of course, I may be mistaken.  If you have in fact lost your job and accumulated a pile of bills, through no fault of your own, and still wish for no one to help you, please tell me and I will retract my assumption.

    I for one will gladly pay whatever taxes necessary to keep our citizens happy and healthy.

  • I think the health care system works pretty well in Australia.  We have free health care for basic things and then you need Insurance for cutting down waiting lists for choose your own specialists.

    All my babies were free, and they were c-sec and the taxes aren’t as high as 50%

    If not free health, then they should most defiantly have payment plans. 

    It is just ridiculous to be banned from health establishments.

    I disagree with some of the above comments, I think basic health care should be provide in western countries free or minimal cost.

    Is it a right?  No…. but I do see it as a necessity.

    x

  • I can only have a part time job because of my medical problems.

    Working part time doesn’t get you any benefits.

    Therefore, I can’t get any help for my medical problems that cause me to only be able to work part time….

    See the vicious cycle?

    I tried to get help from the government but I was told that because I have only had responsible sex and don’t have any bastard kids, I can’t get any help.

    But if I went and spread my legs and popped out a kid or 2, they’d be more than happy to help me out.

    That’s fucked up for real.

  • First of all if you can’t afford health care the government already does provide it for you. Even up to 3 months before you apply to their program. Also in PA for kids there is the Chip program for kids that is entirely based on income which you can have free, reduced, or pay full costs. Now I have heard that some people don’t want to use a govt program like that, but really that is no different then if you use a universal health care plan. Currently it is only available to low income families, but that just keeps taxes down, the more people on it the more our taxes will go up. So if you pay taxes, you already are paying for your health care if you are low income.
    Now more importantly, I believe your title is the answer to this problem. Why aren’t more Christians doing something about this. Many go to other countries to help them with their hospitals. Why aren’t they doing the same thing here? Why is there a bigger Christian movement going on in Africa right now then in the US?  I actually have 5 hospitals within a half hour of me. One is a Catholic hospital in which they are a charity hospital and one of the best in the area. They will reduce your fees or even free based on income and they will gladly set up payment plans if you like too. They also have better service and technology then any of the other hospitals and the staff is much, much friendlier. I personally believe that God is blessing them for doing what is right. I think it is time for Christians here to start being the light that God commanded them to be. And time to stop relying on the government for help.My goodness if you want to see how they can make a mess of what they are in charge of just look at our public education system, or any other public program.

  • My mother is considering filing bankruptcy for that very reason… she had to be put in the hospital (or die- it was extremely serious) from a severe case of pnumonia early last year.  Her employer had cancelled her health insurance without telling her (they hadn’t paid it, and it got dropped)… She barely makes any money as it is, and is trying to support her husband.  It is so depressing for her, she gets so upset about it, and the hospital is garnishing her wages (like I said, she doesn’t make much- but it’s gone) and she can’t pay any of her other bills anymore.  She is down to 108 pounds because she tries to eat once every other day…

  • When the Church dropped the ball, the government stepped in and tried to be the nation’s savior. Now most people look to Uncle Sam, not the Body of Believers for whom Jesus died.

    I long and pray fervently for churches in communities to wake up and do more. In addition to food, clothes, shelter…why not help with prescriptions and medical costs?

    I wholeheartedly believe that if a group of believers made this commitment, Jesus would honor it because of his heart for the hurting and needy; I believe He would take their efforts, bless it and multiply it.

    Can we start with just one neighbor or one family? Can you believe that God would be so honored that in an act of trust, He would give you more resources to expand your care?

    The reason so many Christian ministries have to beg for money is NOT that the givers are always the problem; God Himself could be holding back the resources because of mismangement or wrong agendas!

    God only makes us wealthy to advance HIS Kingdom and do more acts of mercy and redemption to the lost, lonely, and the least.

    Let’s not look for more government, but the Church of Jesus Christ to arise and be who God wants her to be in times of crisis. If not, we will have to answer for what we did with the resources we have been given.

    He’s just waiting for us to dare to give Him the little, so in His hands it can become much!

  • In Matthew 25, Jesus made it very clear that the criterion to be used in determining who would be accepted into God’s kingdom was how one had treated “the least of these.” Those pseudo-christians who so cavalierly deny basic necessities to “the least of these” have never known the God who was in Christ. They’re simply deceiving themselves. In John 8, Jesus accused the religious leaders of his day of having “the devil” for their spiritual father instead of God. I think there is a Biblical mandate to bring that same accusation against today’s “let’s leave the sick and poor to fend for themselves” pseudo-christians.

    …we shouldn’t be forced into helping our fellow man, we should do it out of the love of God (by choice)!

    Wow. What a Godly, compassionate way of approaching the issue. I think we should take this approach one step farther: we should abolish laws against murder so that people refrain from murder solely out of love of God (by choice)! It’s simply amazing how many clever ways people can come up with to avoid doing what Jesus clearly instructed, namely relieving the suffering of those who are disadvantaged. The church has indeed “dropped the ball.” So, some people are jumping in and trying to pick that ball up again using other methods–including government programs. To obstruct them is unconscionable. To obstruct them in the name of Christ is to join those who “…bind heavy burdens, hard to bear, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with their finger.”

  • As a man who has gone through a number of intense medical proceedures in his short 24 year life, I can not back this proposal, I feel as though I have recevied considerablly better care from a private industry than I would from a public, state run system. Not only can I not stomach the thought of the government ruining health care the way they ruined public education, but I can’t help but think that this program would go bankrupt in a matter of years. Seriously, there are 300,000,000 people in the US right now, and of those I am guessing between 100,000,000-175,000,000 would take advantage of the free healthcare. Can you imagine what kind of taxes would have to be levied against us to pay for something like that?

    Also, another reason I am staunchly agianst this is because this is the first step down the long, dark road that ends in Socialism. Nationalizing industries is exactly what places like the USSR did and what countries like Venezulea are doing now. Everyone that thinks this is a revolutionary and great idea today will probably not be so thrilled about it when they need to partake of serious care and get thrown to the back of the line to wait their turn, which unfortunately, may never come.

    Viva la Capitalism, viva la Freedom!

  • Yeah. I’ve been there before. Around 1982-83. Back problem. Lost job. It sucked. But I didn’t expect anyone else to pay the med bills, (or for new baby #3)  any more than I’d expect anyone to pay my mortgage/rent, car payment, utility bills or food. We couldn’t afford CRAP. So what?

    Everything is tied to your economic level. What’s wrong with that? If you are economically worth more to society, you should be compensated more. What’s wrong with that? If you don’t like your economic status, do something to change it. The God-given power is within you.

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